The Anger She Keeps: Finding Home After Abuse & Trauma | Alyse Maslonik

00:00
I had to say something. Like I was just like, I get if no one wants to believe me, but I wouldn't feel right or if I would just not try one more time and then someone else becomes a victim. So that is why I told my mom, but it's interesting. There was so much turmoil in my life, even like when I told my mom, it was not a turning point. It is interesting enough. Like.

00:29
Our life didn't get better, our relationship didn't get better just because I told her and she believed me that time. You know, it did not. I was still so angry and I remained angry for, honestly, almost 10 years. Almost 10 years. I'm in my mid thirties now and it wasn't until I really had my second daughter when I turned 30 that I realized I need to start.

00:55
healing some things. Welcome to the Life Shift Podcast. I'm Matt Gilhooly, and today's guest, Alyse Maslonik, is a survivor of abuse, and she shares how she used her anger from these moments to fuel her life and help others. Alyse's journey started at a young age where she had to live in an abuse shelter, and she experienced that abuse from her stepfather for many years. She also had to deal with the pain of not being believed by her mother when she finally spoke up about that abuse.

01:24
Throughout her life, Alyse struggled with feeling like she never had a safe place to call home, and she found herself in toxic relationships, mistaking them for love. But through her journey of healing, Alyse has learned to recognize what real love is. Her story is a powerful reminder of the impact that abuse can have on a person's life and how it can affect their ability to love and to trust. But it's also a story of resilience and strength, as Alyse has found a way to turn her pain into something positive. By holding onto her anger, she was able to use it

01:53
to propel herself forward and create change. So in today's episode, we'll explore the topics of abuse, love, anger, and creating change with all of it. I hope that Alyse's story will inspire and empower you to recognize your own strength and never give up on that journey of healing. But before we get to the episode, I wanna thank Bryan and Sari and Nic and Gale for sponsoring one episode a month on the Patreon page for the Life Shift podcast. These contributions help to fund the show's development and the monthly costs.

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I appreciate any support you may want to provide, including simply just sharing an episode with people you think might like the show. So if you're interested in directly supporting the show, please visit patreon.com forward slash the life shift podcast. And without further ado, here is my conversation with Alyse Maslonik. I'm Matt Gilhooly, and this is the life shift, candid conversations about the pivotal moments that have changed lives forever.

02:58
Hello, my friends. Welcome to the Life Shift podcast. I am here with a brand new connection, Alyse. Hey, Alyse. Hi, how are you? I am very well. Did I say your name right? Yes, yes you did. That would be embarrassing, right, if you corrected me. You're like, actually, it's whatever. That would be something else. How are things going in your world today? They're going great. I'm so happy to be here. Awesome. And we were talking before we recorded that you are working on a book.

03:27
And I'm assuming that that book is somewhat related to the story that you're going to share today. And we don't have an anticipated release date yet. But if it's come out before this release, there'll be a link in the show notes for everyone to check out. But I don't want to give anything away yet. But I want to put that right up at the front because I know how much work it is for people to, one, process their life enough to put it into words that are forever in print.

03:58
but then to go through the whole publishing, editing, all the pieces that come along with that. And pitching, I'm sure, is part of it. Yes, absolutely. Yeah, how excited are you for it? I am, I'm really excited. It's actually always been a dream of mine. I wrote in my journal whenever I was 13 that I wanted to write a book. And I always wanted this title, my nickname as a child was Allie. And I always wanted to write a book called, Where's Allie?

04:25
and really talk about the identity crisis that I really had as a young child and I didn't know who I was. And it is actually titled The Anger She Keeps, a true story of rage and redemption. And it really is about the how society tells us, especially as women, but and victims of trauma and abuse, that we shouldn't be angry and that we have to let that go. And

04:53
be the bigger person and to be the bigger person, you have to release all of that anger. But my book is really about, what do you do when you don't get rid of that anger? How do you become healed through that process of when that anger burns so bright and there's no way to put it out, what do you do? Are you a bad person? And it's really, really cool because I've learned through that process that anger is so powerful.

05:23
Yeah, I mean, you're human. I often talk about this society's pressures of dot dot dot, whatever that may be, of life. And as you were saying that, I'm thinking, who makes these rules? And I think a lot of it is people putting these pressures on us because they are fearful of anger, in your case. Like,

05:52
they're afraid of it. They don't know how to handle it, so therefore you shouldn't do it. Or even in a grief side, don't be sad, because I'm uncomfortable when you're sad around me. So please don't do that. So I love that you're approaching something that I think people normally kind of shy away from because they're probably afraid of it, but it's a natural human response to...

06:22
a lot of trauma or to anything really. Yeah, and I think it's a bit of a provocative idea to say we should hold on to our anger. Right? But you don't ever hear that. You never hear that. You don't go into a therapist's office and they're like, all right, how can I help you keep the anger? Right? You don't ever get that advice. But what I've learned is I had gone through so much injustice and so much trauma and abuse as a child.

06:51
Anger burns so deeply in my soul and there wasn't enough water, there wasn't enough therapy that was going to allow me to just poof, release it, right? Like it was this fire inside of me. And when I learned not to be scared of it, that it was something to be, that it wasn't something to be shameful of and that I can harness that energy.

07:17
to propel myself forward, that's when things really changed in my life. Yeah, I mean, we'll get into your story in just a second. I just, I love that. I think, you know, when someone has a long-term something, like experience, I guess we'll call it that, it's part of your identity in some cases. And so by someone else asking you to like cut that off, it's like cutting off a piece of your body. Like it is part of you and...

07:45
And I can relate to that in the sense of carrying grief with me for so long, when my mom died when I was a kid. And 20 years of trying to figure out that grief journey for me, it's just part of me. It's not like I dwell on that piece, but it is. It is a component that I will not ignore because it served me in a particular way. And so I love that you're doing that. And we can weave some of that into this conversation today. But maybe.

08:12
You know, just to kind of paint the picture of what your life was like, leading up to where you feel things started to change for you that brought you to this version of Alyse. Sure. So my biological father, whenever I was a child, he did some really bad things and we had to go and live in a domestic abuse shelter. And the police came and saved us from our home. And we lived in a domestic abuse shelter.

08:39
For many years, I had a stepfather that abused me for seven years, and he had multiple victims, unbeknownst to me at the time. And I had lived with that for, until I was about 14. And when I eventually was able to tell people, my mother didn't believe me. And she stayed with him until I was 20 years old. And it turns out that he abused someone else very close to me in my home.

09:09
during that time, but she was scared to speak up because I wasn't believed. So thankfully my mom, when I was in college, I was having a really bad time with flashbacks. And I had reached out to my sister and I said, I need to tell my mom and she needs to understand that I'm not lying. Like I'm not lying and she's still living with this man. And so I finally, at like 3 a.m., I texted my mom.

09:39
and really like a drunken stupor, and said, I need to tell you something, and you need to understand that I'm telling you the truth. And she divorced him that day, packed up everything that she had, kicked him out, pulled out her retirement and drove down to college. She already knew what I was going to say. And she already knew that she had made a mistake in not believing me. So when you reach out, you didn't even...

10:06
You just said, I need to talk to you. And she probably had been thinking about it for the last six years from the first time you told her, saying, what did I do? You know, and I think there's a component of that. First of all, I'm so sorry that you had to go through that. And that was part of your journey. That should not happen to anyone. And people should not be getting away with that. And the important thing here is that you're sharing this in hopes that...

10:36
other people can find their way out of that and hold people accountable to that. But I'm thinking of your mother, who was probably in a situation in which there was probably fear in that as well, right? When you first told her. Oh, yeah. Like, it's so hard thinking about that because that's your kid, that's your husband.

11:03
you might know something about your husband that you are putting down, right? Did you feel that that, did that completely like erase your relationship with her or was this more like from those six years in between, what was that relationship like because of that not believing you? I was so angry with her, Matt. I bet. And it ruined our relationship for probably a decade. It's just been in the last.

11:32
several years and especially with writing my book, has been such a process that I realized I never knew what she was going through, right? And the things that, so long story short, the Child Protective Services came and interviewed me at the time before I spoke to my mom. And I got so scared because I didn't know Child Protective Services was gonna show up. And so then I was scared to tell them everything, you know? And...

12:00
So then when I was talking to my mom, it wasn't matching what CPS Child Protective Services was saying I said. So there were inconsistencies. And then the person that I found out it was also happening to was too scared to say it was happening to her. And so I'm saying, no, it's happening to her. Just ask, just ask. And she would be like, no, I don't know what she's talking about, you know? And I think for my mom, it's...

12:29
Everyone always asks me that, like, how do you have a relationship with her? And I think my mom is the victim, right? Like she, yeah, she was not the perpetrator. Yes, like it's heart wrenching when the person that's supposed to love you, that owes it to love you and be there and protect you doesn't. Like that is really hard, especially at 14 years old, not having anyone. It still brings tears to my eyes, but at the end of the day.

12:55
she was a victim in this and the way that the abuser was able to manipulate and that is their MO, right? That's what they do. And so I can look back and see why those decisions or why she questioned what had happened. And to be honest, you know, when I was 20, the state picked up a criminal prosecution of that abuser. And...

13:22
Me and this other girl were witnesses, so he had multiple victims, but time had really passed since the latest abuse. So we went through an entire trial, and at the end, he walked away a free man. And he walked away. And so I think to myself, if the justice system that is built and designed to protect victims and render justice is not capable of doing so.

13:50
that how could I hold my mom to the same weight, right? And be upset at her when she had four children and was working a job that didn't pay a lot, right? And how was she supposed to just leave, you know? And I think as a mom, I pray every day that I would do things differently. And I know in my heart that I would do things differently.

14:19
but I have to show her grace in the way that it was, the investigation went through CPS. I think that's the story in my life that I want change to happen because we do mothers such a disservice by the way in which child protective services interviews and surprises victims at their school while I'm in religion class, you know, and.

14:47
and you're just supposed to open up and talk about all of these years of abuse, and you're not ready sometimes, you know? Or ever, you know? I think there's, I mean, you were a kid too. Like 14, as much as we wanna feel like we're grownups at 14, you're a kid, right? And you know, and that's, there's a fear base. You said the manipulation of, you know, the perpetrator is strong in the house. There's a power there, there's a money.

15:17
of like, what am I gonna do as far as your mom goes? So, you know, I completely understand, one, the anger and the anger you had for your mom at that time, right? Because in our 14-year-old brains, the role of mother is to protect us. And we don't necessarily understand all the inner workings and the things that are happening to them.

15:43
because they're adults, they should know everything, right? In our heads, we're like, they know everything and they should take care of me, but I also know everything because I'm a teenager, right? That's such a good point too, Matt. It's like, I never, because again, I'm a child, so I only see things through these glasses and these binoculars, right? So I couldn't fathom what was going on behind the scenes that she was meeting with CPS.

16:10
and having meetings and they were telling her, well, maybe it was the previous stepdad that abused them and she's just having dreams that it was him, you know? And so they're pouring all of this into her saying that they're the experts, right? So she's trying to listen to the experts. And meanwhile, you know, her daughter is really drowning with no one. And now I'm living with my abuser and now he knows that I told.

16:40
And I have to live with him for years and years and years. So you had to stay. Past that. And it was really, really scary for me. And I felt for so many years, just so unsafe in my own home. And so I always say that there's this quote that says, I'm homesick for a place I'm not sure even exists. And I felt my whole life like that, that I've never had that sense of home.

17:10
because I've never lived it. You never had a safe place to land, a safe place to like, you know, you often think about if you have had that, you often think about the moments where you can just be without thoughts running through your mind. It's like a safe, you know, like you are wrapped in safe and I can imagine that seven years of abuse, then you tell a story, now you have this additional.

17:39
fear of, well, now they know, the abuser's still in the home. There's still this.

17:48
I don't know, that you turn any corner and the person can be there. You say something, something could happen. You know, like you could say, like, I hate this dinner and you don't know what triggers all around. So you've got- It's a constant state of living in fear and living in that fight or flight. Yes, like the hyper aware of everything. I feel like that is...

18:17
Still to this day, it's something that I struggle with. You could look at me and think that I have nothing on my mind. But now I'm watching, like I'm trying to hear the sounds behind me in case someone comes up from behind or like very simple things. Like for many years until a few years ago, I would genuinely lock myself into my bedroom at 28 years old so that I could blow dry my hair because.

18:43
The sound was so loud that I couldn't tell if someone was coming at me. So I would only blow dry my hair if the door was locked. Like it's wild to think about that. And that was, you know, at 28 years old, it's 14 years since that had happened. You know, it's wild how it ingrains every part of who you are when you don't heal. Before I ask you about the...

19:11
the reason you felt that night you had to call your mom. I'm wondering if you, in your reflection now, look back at your own personal development from 14 to adult, right? Because I can imagine that if you're in this heightened state of fear, is there room to grow as a human? Is there room to do well in school? Is there room to...

19:40
mature in the way that the girl down the street is maturing because she doesn't have that heightened fight or flight kind of thing. Have you reflected on that and thought about that? I have. And I'm so glad that you asked that question because oftentimes...

20:00
I want people that have been through similar things and experiences to understand that it has a true impact on who you are, right? And for me, my life really stopped the moment that my mom didn't believe me. And I stayed stuck there for so long, right? And because of that, having the one person that is supposed to...

20:28
they're obligated to love you. They're your mom, you know? Feel me feeling like she didn't and she discarded me for a man. I never really understood or learned through action what love was. So I graduate from high school, go to college, move to North Carolina, meet a man that was nice for me one time, nice to me one time, and I...

20:57
feel like I owe my life to this person, even though it quickly became a very awful, toxic relationship. And so I found myself in a very, very scary marriage, but convincing myself that this is what love is. It is this back and forth, crazy, like I love you one minute and then I'm gonna hurt you the next, right? Like that to me was something that I was used to and that I equated.

21:26
to love. So you're right, like I never developed a full sense of what love really can be. I mean, I would venture to say that your life kind of stopped growing at seven or at that younger age because, and that probably formed, well, this is a quote unquote father figure. Is this what it's supposed, you know, like is this what love is?

21:56
And your description of falling into a relationship because someone showed you one tiny morsel of niceness is probably very, very common. And I would almost equate it to, and please forgive me, I don't mean to discount this at all, but someone going through like a depression. Someone that is depressed, staying in that depression state.

22:25
is very much like a comfort, like a blanket, like it's familiar. I feel at home, I feel that this space is. And I wonder if in its own strange way, did that relationship feel comfortable because of what it was? Because another really good question, because again, when I say like I never felt home, right? Because my home was so chaotic.

22:55
Right? It was just chaos. So I grew to love chaos. Right? Like, or I could at least anticipate it. Or I knew- You knew how to function in it. Yeah, I knew how to function in it. So anything that was stable scared me. Yeah. Scared me. Because when's the next hack gonna drop? Yes. And I would sell, what is that called? Self-destruct or anything when it got stable, it was like, I don't know how to live in this space. Yeah, sabotage it.

23:24
Yes, absolutely. And it's so interesting because during the time, whenever I was 15, I met a boy. His name is Jordan and he is now my husband. And I loved that boy, you know, whenever I was younger and he was always just so stable in this like chaos. And I used to always like going through life, still be in love with him after I had moved away and.

23:49
I would just remember like how strong and steady he was. And it was just something so different than what I had ever had, you know? And the really cool thing is after I finally escaped that marriage, I moved back to Pennsylvania and he and I, my husband picked up right where we left off when we were teens. And, but for a long time, it was so hard to recognize myself and this as love, he's a very...

24:18
A person that shows love through his actions, acts of service is certainly his love language. For me, I learned that people just need to tell me they love me and then I will feel like that's love and they could treat me terribly. Right. Right? But as long as they're saying they love me, I felt and equated that to love. And so in the first part of our marriage, it was really difficult, Matt, because I had to shift and say...

24:46
You know, my husband now doesn't speak it to me as often as I would like, right? But through actions every day, every day, he shows me that he loves me, whereas the other side was they would tell me they love me, but their actions never equated to that. And I can imagine that seeing those acts of love that were like genuine was probably also jarring too. Like, is this real? Like,

25:15
What is this? What's the motive? What's behind this? I'm sure that there's a lot of that. And that totally, I mean, I think that a lot of people, unfortunately, will relate to your story and kind of what you've done. But I'd like to, I don't know specifically what your pivotal moment is, but I'm wondering, was that texting your mom? Do you see that as the kind of like the first shatter of something? What was?

25:43
What made you do that, first of all? What made you that moment at three o'clock in the morning, besides maybe the beverages? It's interesting that you ask that question. So my sister had a girlfriend, and that girlfriend had a daughter that was like three years old, and they needed a place to stay. And so they were gonna ask my mom if they could live at my mom's house. And I knew that...

26:13
that was just putting that little girl into the lion's den and he doesn't have any of his aged victims living in that home anymore. So if they move a three-year-old into that home that she's gonna fall victim to him. So I was just really sick about it for so long and I had to say something. Like I was just like.

26:40
I get if no one wants to believe me, but I wouldn't feel right or if I would just not try one more time and then someone else becomes a victim. So that is why I told my mom. But it's interesting. There was so much turmoil in my life even like when I told my mom, it was not a turning point. It is interesting enough. Like our

27:06
Our life didn't get better. Our relationship didn't get better just because I told her and she believed me that time. It did not. I was still so angry and I remained angry for honestly almost 10 years. Almost 10 years. I'm in my mid thirties now and it wasn't until I really had my second daughter when I turned 30 that I realized I need to start.

27:31
healing some things. Do you think that, you know, we're just going to assume here, we're going to make assumptions here, that your mom was always waiting for that text message? To find, because she was too afraid to make the first step, and so like you opened the door a little bit so she could escape? That's a good question too. I'm so glad you're asking me this. At the time when I told my mom, my mom is the smartest woman. I know.

28:00
she is smart and life was not kind to her in any way, shape or form. She really got the short end of the stick and she always had these dreams of going to college and right before like right when I was telling her she was looking to go back to college and to really make something and live up to the potential that she saw in herself and we all saw in her and I think that through that was her key to get out like when I think of her.

28:27
I think of in that moment, those keys to college were her way out. And then I ruined it. Right? I ruined it. And so then she or she perceived that I ruined it. I did not ruin it. I know that I did not, but she perceived that I ruined it. But when I told her again, you know, she did go back to college and she had already graduated and got an amazing job, amazing job, graduated top of her class. And she was in a different financial situation.

28:58
number one. And number two, I do think that

29:06
What made the difference, and I don't think it was me, I really think it was the other person that finally, I called the other person, they also called my mom, and I think my mom just needed to hear it from someone else other than me. And that still to this day, Matt, it still bothers me, and I can't lie about it. I love my mother and I know she's a great mom, but every time I think about that, it still really hurts me, because I...

29:34
It wasn't just because I said it again. Yeah, it's, I mean, it's hard to look back, right? Because we, you know, we know that or we we can assume that these people made decisions based on what they knew at the time and what they the circumstances that they were in and the abilities that they had at the time. But we can still hold how we felt about that. And that's completely valid. So I get that I get

30:03
I mean, that decision, like you said, paused your life, paused your growth, paused any ability, maybe, to trust others for a long, long time. Like, why would I tell you if the only person that I think in my life is going to believe me doesn't? What's the point, right? I can see that that's how someone would develop and hold that because...

30:31
Again, you're a kid, right? You don't have all the ability to understand all the nuance in life when you're 14 years old, especially when you've been stunted since you were six or seven. And then I think too, another really important point that I think a lot of people resonate with is when you have someone that's supposed to be there for you and they're not, and then they're saying that, no, this didn't happen when you're like, wait, I lived it, it did happen. Then when you get into a relationship,

31:01
right, with someone that can become abusive, right? When they're saying, when you're like, ouch, you hurt me, right? And they're like, no, I didn't. It's so hard. It is so hard. And I see how women and other, I don't mean to just say women, but women and men and everyone can get into and be stuck in abusive relationships because my mind was developed to not trust what I am feeling, what I am seeing.

31:31
what I am experiencing. And so whenever I had my first big relationship, I'm literally have had two relationships, my husband and this one. And it was because I could not trust myself in when he would do bad things and he would say he wasn't, I would believe him over me because no one ever believed me, right? So

32:01
because it developed in me that.

32:06
inability to believe me. Yeah, like, it's like gaslighting yourself, essentially, you know, at that point, because you were gaslit for so long, you're like, well, let me just absorb that. And I'm just gonna, I don't need other people to do it. I can do it to myself at this point and continue that on. Yeah, I think, I think it's so relatable, unfortunately, right, like I feel like that's terrible that it's relatable because, you know, you think...

32:33
Like we think of us as like fully formed humans that can do all these things, but things in our past will stick with us and form us and especially in your situation in which it was like stunted in a way. And that you were kind of living as that 14 year old probably in that relationship, right? Like when you were in that abusive relationship, you were probably still thinking as that 14 year old to in whatever decisions you were making because they were out of fear.

33:03
Absolutely, and it's so true. I look back at like the decisions. My gut was telling me not to get married. Don't do it, right? But then I would think like my 14 year old self and think, no, Liesch, you're just making this up. It's not that bad. It's fine. And so it was really a lot of how I developed and what my mom had done to me that I made those decisions to move forward with a marriage that I knew was really bad.

33:32
It's so interesting and I know that there's other people out there that have felt the same thing and so often you can get so down on yourself and I just want people to know that it is normal. It's not, you're not weird or you're not broken or you're not It's, this is a normal reaction to abuse and if you're feeling like you can't understand your own reality

34:01
or you shouldn't believe your own reality. It's just take that moment for a second and believe yourself one time. If you're gonna believe yourself at any moment, let it be that and go and really try to start healing that part of you because until you can overcome that, it will be a cycle that you live in and you think you escaped, but it'll come right back. What was the trigger that...

34:29
that kind of got you to start that healing journey? Like, what, was there any specific thing that kind of like, okay, it's time? Yeah, I don't ever talk about this, but my ex-husband, we were separated at the time, and he had become a heroin addict. And I got a call that he ran someone over and killed them while he was high on heroin.

34:55
And they asked me to, like his parents asked me to come. I drove from South Carolina to North Carolina to the crime scene. And it was awful. He was like 112 pounds, six foot one, where it's like August in North Carolina. It's like 90 degrees and he's wearing sweatpants and a hoodie. And he, they were like asking me, they're like, you're gonna come back, right? He needs you. Like, if you don't come back, I'm gonna lose my only son.

35:26
And I remember standing there, and there is literally the man's dead body on the ground, and they're asking me and telling me I need to come back. And I remember thinking, oh my goodness, like, am I crazy? Because this is my moment that just solidified I need to run, right? Like I need to finally, like, not just be separated, but like file for divorce and be done, but they're telling me I need to come back. So it was like,

35:56
so hard for me, so I ended up checking myself into a mental health hospital for 72 hours, so that not because I felt like I was crazy, but I needed everyone else's opinions to stop for a second, if that makes sense. I'm thinking of what my mom would do, what his parents wanted me to do, what he wanted me to do, and it all was not aligning with what my soul was telling me to do.

36:23
and I had gone my whole life not listening to my soul because I was double guessing from everyone else's inputs and my experiences and I wasn't going with my gut. And so I checked myself in. That's amazing. Yeah, it was a scary experience though, being in a place like that. And, but when I got in there, I realized, I am not crazy. I am surrounded by crazy. Do you know? And I am...

36:52
surrounded by people in my life that just are taking everything from me that they can and leaving the scraps, right? And so that was my biggest turning point. It was the most embarrassed, low, saddest time in my life, but it was also something that I desperately needed because had I not gone there and drew a line in the sand to say,

37:20
Now I need to listen to my, like I need all of you guys to stop talking and I need to make this decision on my own. I would have gone back. He probably would have killed me, you know? Well, let me just tell you, from an outsider's perspective, I don't see that as the lowest. I see that as like a strong point. Checking yourself into something that society tells you is X, Y, Z, terrible, oh my gosh, you're at the end, that's strength.

37:49
You knew that you couldn't do this in the space that you were in. You just needed a second. Just give me a minute to be alone with my thoughts, to make decisions for myself. I see that as so strong. How many people do you know would do that? Not many. And if someone's checking themselves in, they're probably being forced to, right? They're probably being.

38:16
made to do that because something is happening, because there is a moment. But you took that as, this is how I save myself. That's huge. And I don't know people that would do that. So I hope someday you can see that as a moment of like, wow, this is probably the first time you put yourself first. Yeah, it is true. I love that you say that. So thanks for saying that because...

38:45
When I think about it, I was just, I guess I just wanted, and I'm sure there's people listening that can feel this way. I just wanted to be able to say that I did it on my own. These people didn't win, right? And so for some reason in my brain, I say, oh, well that was me giving up and saying, I need help. But really, you're right. By doing that, it was not allowing them to win. That was the moment where we see

39:14
where I saw I'm giving up and I need help, right? It wasn't, it was me saying enough, right? Enough, and I'm going to leave all of the trauma in the past because I can't carry it anymore. Yeah, you're closing the door on them. You walk into this facility, when that door closes, you can't hear them anymore. You're in your own box of soundproof, kind of like, not literally, but you're in this space where

39:42
where their echoes don't matter anymore. And do you see those 72 hours or however long you ended up staying there, do you see those as the moment when you emerged, did you feel like a different version of you? I did, I certainly did. I crafted a plan while I was in there, I had a son with this man and I was really scared and how to leave.

40:09
And his family was very connected to the courts. His mom worked there for 30 years, Southern, you know, kind of situation. So- We'll leave that there. Yes. So with that being said, I was really scared. And so during that time, it gave me 72 hours to four minute create a plan without everyone else's input of how to get me and my son safely away.

40:38
Go with my gut and I needed that and if I didn't end up checking myself in like I would have never Had that time to just Focus on okay. How does this play out if I make this one? How does this play out if I see if I do this way, right? So yes, I I look back at it as when I came out of there it was like I Have a plan to leave and a plan to leave safely No, I think I think that's amazing. I think that

41:08
more people need to prioritize themselves. And if it means doing something like what you did that society, here we go again, tells us that is like a bad thing. If that's what you need, that's what you need, right? And it allows you, like you said, to form a plan without probably what you would have done before is like, hey, what do you think about this idea to so and so?

41:36
and then they would have talked you out of that because, oh, what if this happens? What if that happens? And now you have no one to do that with besides yourself. So you get the gut now that you get to find a way to trust. Absolutely, and I think you're right. I think that the stigma around checking, I still carry that. I can tell you, right, Matt, that- Yeah, you just said it. A defining moment in my life, but I do not talk about it

42:06
for fear of that being used against me. And I think a lot of it too was in my life being told that I was crazy and that I was making these things up. And so then checking myself in, are they then gonna be like, well, see, she is crazy. Do you see what I'm saying? So it was, I don't talk about that in my life because I think one, I'm still surrounded by a lot of people that were with me whenever I was 14. And

42:35
through that. And so I don't want them to have a thing to say, hey, see, but that's them. I need to let it go. It's something that I still struggle with clearly, because it was so helpful in my life. And it shouldn't be something that isn't talked about. Because if it wasn't, he no joke, he I may not be here. If I didn't have a plan to leave. Well, and that was like, your first taste of trusting yourself.

43:05
and trusting that, oh, maybe I do know what's best for me. Maybe I don't need other people to rule my life and make those decisions for me. What were some of the first big changes that happened when you were able to leave this person and kind of start creating the life for yourself? So I moved back from North Carolina to Pennsylvania. So back to my hometown.

43:34
with home state and I got a job selling real estate for a home builder. I had always had really good jobs, right? I've always had good jobs. I think that's a proof thing, by the way. I think I can relate to that as well of like, you always gotta be good because you don't want other people to know that like, you could be broken on the inside. Yes, it was so true. It's so funny that you say that too, because honestly, Matt, I, for so long, I was just in this like race to get.

44:03
every promotion possible, because I wanted to show that I wasn't nothing. Yes. And so I was really on this conquest, I would say. Well, you also want probably that inner 14-year-old wants that outside validation. You want the external validation that you are worthy. You are something more than what other people told you you weren't. 100%. And so I moved back.

44:29
It's so interesting. I moved back and I was at a restaurant out like almost three hours from where I used to live when I dated my current husband Jordan. And at the restaurant, I hear Alyse and I turn around and it's our like best friends from when we were teenagers, Wade and Jenny. And I turn around and I was like, what are you doing here? And they said, what are you doing here? And I said, I, you know, I moved back and told them my story and they said, does Jordan know that you're back?

45:00
And I, by the way, the day that I was like supposed to get married to my first husband, I did not show up because I was still in love with Jordan. Okay. I eventually just got married at a courthouse. Everyone told me that I was stupid and I just needed to move on and, you know, get married. So, so they said, does Jordan know that you're back? And I said, no. So I was like talking around it and then they told him and from then on we just like picked up where we left off and.

45:28
It's just been a really cool life. I have three kids with my, you know, high school love and it's been awesome. It's been again, it's hard to go from living like this to living like this. But I would take this all day long, even though sometimes it makes me a bit crazy. And I like to spice things up. It is so nice to have like, a place now where when I'm here, I am home. Yeah.

45:56
You kind of feel that now. Feel that, yeah. Did you notice a difference in when you started reconnecting with Jordan? Because now you were a different person, right? You were starting to really, I don't know, I wouldn't say fully trust yourself yet. I'm sure there are always going to be pieces in which you have some self-doubt because of that experience that you've had. But did you find that you learned more about yourself in this relationship with Jordan? Oh, yeah.

46:25
Oh yes. I just, when we first started like dating again, I would literally just cry, Matt, like cry and be like, why are you so nice? Like, because I would say like, hey, I would set a boundary like, hey, you know, cause at the time we still lived like two hours away from each other. I lived like in Harrisburg, he lived towards, you know, out here and so I'd be like, no, I'm not coming out towards you. And he would say, that's fine, I'll come to you.

46:54
And that had, like, to me, that never happened in my life. Like, if I said, no, I'm not making that drive. You'd be convinced to do it. I would be convinced to do it. And no one would ever make that drive out to me. And he would do that religiously. Even on work night, he's an engineer. And so he would start work at 6.30 in the morning at his office. And so he would drive out and leave at 4 AM to get to, and that's not convenient for him, but.

47:24
It was the first time that I was really seeing like in a romantic relationship that people will be inconvenienced because they love you and it's better for you. Like, and I've always been the one that had to be inconvenienced. I've never had anyone do that for me. That was hard, but it was also really beautiful to like get that concept. I bet it was scary. Like what's happening? You know, I used to have to fight for this. I used to have to beg for love.

47:54
or what, let's quote, quote unquote love, that wasn't love that you experienced before. Yeah, I can imagine what that does to you because it's almost like the pause button that you said kind of pause at 14 was like you finally pressed it again and playing. So now you have this gap that you kind of have to build back up and figure out life like, what is this? Who am I?

48:21
How do I function in this world of actual love in which people care for me? And then, and I don't know, I go into these conversations with very little information because I wanna have conversation. I don't think I would ask you some of these questions if I knew part of your story, but I know that you've done some stuff in a professional sense that, beyond the book, but that stems.

48:49
from your experiences, maybe you can share a little bit about that because I think that's important part of your journey as well is that one, you're recovering personally, but now you're trying to help other people with it. Yeah, it's been really cool. Two years ago, I decided I was gonna quit my job, but it was that whole thing that I was just trying to climb the ladder because I wanted some sort of outside validation. And so I quit my job and I started a business so that I could raise financial aid.

49:18
and scholarships for underprivileged kids that were like me. And in our first year, we raised $8.5 million that impacts nearly 10,000 students in our state. And it's just so cool because I am the only one, only woman business owner that has the lived experience of receiving a scholarship like that and now having a company that...

49:45
raises those scholarships. So I've really used my life and my story to raise these funds to help other students. So it is really cool and it's allowed me to, I'm always a competitive person, but I'm not competitive in that, like I'm trying to run away from my past anymore, where I was in corporate America, just wanting to climb the ladder in every promotion so that I could say, look, I'm not that person.

50:14
It's very different and it's been very healing in the last two years since then. That's amazing. And it's your company is is solely trying to raise money for these scholarships. Is that like the full full time gig or does it have other components to it? Yeah, there are other components. So we help. We have like enrollment technology. So we help private and non-public schools grow enrollment. And but.

50:40
I would say about 90% of our business is raising those scholarships. And we don't keep a single dime of the scholarships that we raise. So we don't charge like a commission or keep any of it, which is really cool to me. And the other really cool thing is always a dream of mine. We have what's called the triumph over tragedy scholarship award. So it's something that from our profit every year, I give additional students that have really been through some traumatic

51:06
experiences, but that have remained resilient in the face of adversity. We give them additional funds for college or trade school or whatever they need it for. We are that hand up to them that can make a really big difference. So that's been awesome. That's amazing. I mean, I think it's one, it's just really hard to get out of that cycle, right? And it took you a while, but you did. And now I can imagine.

51:34
that your story is what is fueling, like your terrible, horrible story that you would never wish on any person, even if you hated them, you wouldn't wish this on them. Your story is what is helping to raise funds to help other people escape similar stories.

51:57
And that's why the book is called The Anger She Keeps, because it really is about this anger that I have inside of me that I've turned into a way to fuel progress for others. Yeah, and we have to honor all these pieces of our lives and how they've shaped us into the people that we are. We don't have to like what happened to us. In many cases, most of us don't. But.

52:25
What can we do with it? And your just this story, this arc, it shows the power that stories have. The stories we tell ourselves for so long, right? That power that you gaslighting yourself essentially after everyone else was doing it and then you took it upon yourself. That power kept you in that space for so long. And then you were able to be brave and check yourself into.

52:54
this space to give yourself just some quiet. Shut all systems down, essentially, like all the ones around you, and be able to get out, and then start building your own story, not the story that everyone else was telling you to tell yourself. Man, I mean, it's just, it's really inspiring, and I'm so moved by what you shared, because when you started out, I was like,

53:23
You know, like honestly, like this is, this is tragedy upon tragedy. You know, and no one should have to go through that, but look what you've done. Do you look back on that and you're like, shit, this really sucked. But dot dot dot. Yes, that is so true. I look back on my life and I am moved to tears of gratitude. Like, isn't that weird to say? Yes, it is. It is. It's so weird. But I.

53:53
wake up sometimes and I'm like driving to my office, that I have an office that I have, and I just cry, but not sad. Just like I wrote in my journal when I was 13 years old, this is not the existence that God wants for me. I will change this cycle. And I look back and I think about that moment so often that when life was so dark for me, for some reason I always believed.

54:23
always that there was beauty waiting for me if I would just make it through. I always believed that and I had never found it. So I felt like I kept going and going, but I was never finding it and to arrive, it's magnificent. Yeah. And you look back on those moments and probably like, did I have to go through that to be this version of me? I mean, my mom died when I was eight.

54:51
And people often ask me, like, if you could go back in time, would you change it? And I'm like, well, knowing who I am now and where this journey has brought me and how crappy that 20 years of trying to grieve her was, that made me this version of me. That made me have this podcast. That made me have this conversation with you. And who knows who's gonna listen to this and change their circumstances or feel less alone in their circumstances or.

55:20
Just know that there's some hope, right? That you can kind of get out of the cycle that was created for you and then you perpetuated, and then it just, at some point it gets too much and you gotta get out. Thank you for sharing your story with me and having this conversation and sharing the part that you felt was really, I don't know if the word embarrassing is it, but for sharing that because I think that was your strength.

55:47
Yeah, you're welcome. Like I said, I don't talk about it often. It was hard for me to even include it in the book, but they were like, you need to include this in the book. So, no, I appreciate you having a space for people to share their stories because I was that person that had no hope. And hearing someone else's stories and knowing that there was someone out there that their parents didn't believe them or that they had gone through this and their life is good now, I would have appreciated that back then.

56:18
I like to kind of wrap up the conversations with a question. And I'm wondering if you could go back to Alyse right after you told your mom and she didn't believe you. And this version of you knowing all you know, is there anything you could do or say to her that or you would want to do or say to her?

56:40
I think I would just say that if I know now that mom, I know it's really hard to understand and I know your backgrounds and your lived experiences, but I'm telling you, I am telling the truth and do not spend the rest of these six years with this man. You know, I don't think I know.

57:08
I would have been kinder to my mom during all of it. What about to your 14-year-old self? I don't know. I think just giving her a hug and saying that, like, if I would have known that upwards of 90% of parents do not believe their children whenever they tell them about abuse, I wish I would have told... someone would have told me that back then, because I felt like I was the only one.

57:36
that had a mom that didn't believe me. You know, so I think on with that knowledge, I would have shared that with myself. And a hug. I heard so many people just say like, there's really nothing I could say, but that person just really needed a hug. They needed to know that they were loved and they will be loved and they will be loved in the right way at some point.

58:01
Thank you for sharing your story on the Life Shift podcast. I really appreciate it. And we will share the information so people can find out about your company and what you're doing for the kids in your area and kind of building that life. And then when you get that book information, we will share that as well. So I appreciate you, and thank you for being a part of this. You're welcome. Thank you so much. Of course. And if you are listening to the show and you enjoy it, please.

58:30
Just leave a rating, maybe a little written review. That would be lovely. And we will be back next week with a brand new episode. Thanks, Alyse. Thank you.

58:48
For more information, please visit www.thelifeshiftpodcast.com