How Carol Look Found Joy When Her Loved Ones Struggled with Addiction

Carol Look00:00:00

And a woman comes out to give the family lecture and she had had the worst story I had ever heard. Drinking, drinking, drinking, baby being taken away from her, still drinking, like, just incredible. I was like. And she was happy.And she said, you can be happy and have a good life even if your alcoholic keeps drinking. And I was like, what? Who are you? What are you talking about? My mother is my mother. No. Yes. No. And that was the turning point for me.That was a decision for me of this is what I'm going to do. I'm going to help people understand that they can be happy no matter what's going on. They can have a life.Even if someone, they, the closest person to them in their life, decides to go down a different path.

Matt Gilhooly00:00:46

Today's guest is Carol Look. She is a psychotherapist, she's an EFT tapping expert, an author, and truly an all around inspirational human.Her story is one of personal growth and it reflects on our ability to overcome really immense challenges. In this episode, Carol shares her deeply personal experiences growing up in a family that was really affected by alcoholism.We talk about the pivotal moment that gave her permission to really focus on her own happiness.She takes us through her journey of finding healing through traditional therapy and energy work, including her life changing discovery of EFT tapping.We'll explore how she transformed her own pain into a mission to help others break free from from self sabotage and embrace lives of fulfillment and true connection.Together we talk about themes of overcoming trauma and the importance of community in healing and truly the validation that comes with sharing our stories. I think if you're a fan of other conversations of healing on the Life Shift podcast, I think this one will resonate with you as well.So without further ado, here is my conversation with Carol. Look, I'm Matt Gilhooly and this is the Life Shift candid conversations about the pivotal moments that have changed lives forever. Hello, my friends.Welcome to the Life Shift podcast. If you are watching the video, you're seeing a new background.So I just want to say that for year four, I started with a new background, but I do want to invite our guests to have a wonderful conversation today. So hello, Carol.

Carol Look00:02:27

Hi, Matt. It's so great to be here with you.

Matt Gilhooly00:02:29

Well, thank you for wanting to be a part of the Life Shift podcast. It has been an unexpected, beautiful, strange journey for me.So thank you for wanting to just be a part of this, this beautiful healing journey I'm calling it.

Carol Look00:02:45

Absolutely. I read about it and heard some episodes and I thought it is a healing journey. It is, it's providing something really valuable. So I was, I'm honored.

Matt Gilhooly00:02:54

It's actually just really special to think of this eight year old version of me who had his Life Shift moment and thinking about how now, at 44, now, I get to talk to people that I otherwise probably never would have bumped into in my life.And I get to have conversations that I feel I was conditioned to not have growing up because it was too personal or too invasive of a question or too controversial of a question to ask.And it's just so weird to think back of that little kid and I wish I could tell him that the journey that he was about to go on would be so healing eventually. The Life Shift podcast, just for anyone that's listening for the first time, because you're on it, stems from that eight year old version of me.When I was eight, I was visiting my father. My parents lived about a thousand miles apart and I was visiting my dad for summer and my mom was going on a.The second time, going on a motorcycle trip with her boyfriend to Colorado from Massachusetts.And one day I got picked up early from summer camp and I was brought to my dad's office and my dad had to sit me down and tell me that my mom had been killed in a motorcycle accident.And at that moment, everything that I had ever dreamed of my life looking like was no longer a possibility because I didn't have the primary person that was always around every day because I really didn't live with my dad too much. I just kind of visited him.And this was late 80s, early 90s, so people weren't really talking about, like, how to help a little kid through something like this. And what I absorb from the adults around me was that they needed to see that I was happy. And so I didn't get to grieve.So for about 20 years, I kind of just used it as a crutch, used it as a blame game, used it as something other than kind of processing the grief properly.And I say all that because in that journey I always wondered and probably logically knew if other people had these line in the sand moments in which words said to them something happened to them, whatever it may be, everything changed from one minute to the next. And so that's why this show exists.I get to talk to people like you, Carol, about these, you know, moments in time in which you look to the left and it's a different person than if you look to the right. And so it has, just like you said, like I said, it's Just been such this beautiful healing journey.Every conversation kind of puts another band aid on that little version of me.

Carol Look00:05:32

Sweet. Sweet. What? I mean, what a trauma at any age but eight. Oh. Oh, that hurts. Oh, that hurts.

Matt Gilhooly00:05:40

Yeah. And it's. You know, I look at this show as these conversations are ones that I wish I had overheard.You know, if I had overheard this version of me telling my story about being okay now and going through everything and realizing that everything was going to work out in the long run.So I hope there are people out there that maybe identify with experiences that you're going to share today, and they feel less alone in that experience or they feel validated in that experience that, oh, I'm not weird, or this is not a. A weird thing for me to think or feel, you know, and that's just the beauty of storytelling, I think.Just in general, you're an author as well, so, like, you probably understand the elements of storytelling and how that can change people's lives.

Carol Look00:06:28

So healing to feel you're not alone and to say, oh, I've been in my own little cave for years, and I didn't know other people experienced feelings and conflicts and upset, and it's very, very freeing.

Matt Gilhooly00:06:41

Right. Well, and it's funny, too. And I admit this full heartedly. Like, logically, I knew I wasn't the only person to have a dead mom.And logically, I knew all the things.But it really felt very isolating and alone because I think society taught us that we weren't supposed to show people we were feeling that way at the time. Do you think it's getting better now?

Carol Look00:07:05

I have mixed feelings about that, Matt. Well, it's better. I think it is better. I think it's more acceptable. I think it's better.And there's still so many people in pain who in their world don't have permission. Permission.Societally, we could say, sure, everybody can share their feelings and a lot of people go get help, but I think a lot of people are hurting and don't feel the freedom in their unit, their family, their community to share what's really going on.

Matt Gilhooly00:07:35

Yeah, I hope they hear the Life Shift podcast and then maybe they feel a little bit of permission. But in any case, let's get into you before we tell your Life Shift story, though. Maybe you can kind of tell us who Carol is in 2025.

Carol Look00:07:47

Like, how do you identify 2025? Well, things have changed. What's very interesting is that I spend a lot of time with my nieces and nephews now that I didn't wasn't years ago.And sometimes the vacations are around that. And my husband says, I love them to smithereens. They're adorable.But don't call it my vacation when I'm cooking for these little guys anyway, so that's very, very different. Just to be Aunt Carol somewhat, a lot of the time. But I identify as, really, my favorite thing is, is being a friend.A very loyal, loyal, connected friend. Connection is one of my absolute deepest values. And being a therapist and an EFT coach that helps people. Give them, I give them permission.I hold the space and let them just say, spew, cry, hurt, yell whatever they need to do and say, huh. Deep breath. That feels better. Because that's what I didn't have early enough in my life.And when I finally found it, it was like, I didn't know, like you were saying. I didn't know. We were allowed to. We were, in fact, told not to specifically. Don't go outside the family.

Matt Gilhooly00:09:03

Yeah. Don't sweep it under the rug. You're fine, everything's cool. Don't worry about it.

Carol Look00:09:08

And you're a good student and you play soccer and hockey and you're, you know, in the choir, and so everything's fine.

Matt Gilhooly00:09:17

Yeah, everything on the surface is totally fine.No, and I think that's beautiful that you're, I mean, obviously people feeling hurt is so important, but you're also bringing the tools to help them move through those things, which is the big step after sharing your story is one thing. And being able to get it out is, is very healing in itself. Just saying the words out loud for me.Sometimes the things in my head are far scarier than when I vocalize them or write them down. Then I'm like, oh, okay, that's palatable.But then you having the training and the education and all the things now coming in and saying, here is a menu of things you could try or do to kind of move through. Is that accurate?

Carol Look00:10:00

Yes. Yes, absolutely. Yeah.

Matt Gilhooly00:10:03

Because I, I, I, I don't want to elevate what I'm trying to do, having people tell stories to the level of what you're offering to the world. So thank you for what you're doing for individuals. But then from the ripple effect from that one individual, really the world you're changing.

Carol Look00:10:20

So that's beautiful. Thank you.

Matt Gilhooly00:10:21

You're changing the world. The end.

Carol Look00:10:22

Thank you. The end.

Matt Gilhooly00:10:24

The end of our story. No, I think I, I love that. And it took me 30 something years to find a therapist that worked for me. Took me five tries in that early 30s.But when I found the right one, it was the puzzle piece. It was the thing that I needed to unlock the story of making all my decisions since I was 8 with the scared mentality of that little kid.So, you know, you're changing lives and you're changing the world. Because if I didn't have that particular therapist, we wouldn't have these conversations, you know, like. Right, the ripple.

Carol Look00:10:57

Love the ripple effect. Love it.

Matt Gilhooly00:10:59

So I'd love it if we could have you kind of paint the picture of your life leading up to kind of this life shift moment. And you can paint back as far as you need to to give us the context. But I'll let you tell your story in your way.

Carol Look00:11:14

Let me start with the moment and where it was. So we were in a rehab center for my mother, who was alcoholic, and we had brought her there, which. So the guilt was incredible. Right.Her shame was incredible. We were angry, we were hurt. She wouldn't stop drinking. Then she'd stop, then she'd drink again.You know, anybody who's lived with alcoholism understands this pattern. And it was just so painful for me because my mother and I were very, very close. So I couldn't understand. And it was not explained to me.If you're so close and you love her and she loves you so much, because my parents were very loving and very giving, why would she drink? What? I don't. I couldn't get it. And I wasn't, you know, I could not understand. And the worst part of it came later. It was.I wasn't five, I wasn't eight. It was more teens. What happened is we went to this rehab and it was not the first one. Right.So the disappointment and the fear and the hypervigilance. So that's. Imagine me growing up with that. Yes.Great student, athlete, singer in the school plays, et cetera, and panicked and upset about home all the time.

Matt Gilhooly00:12:24

Yeah. Can I ask you before you go into that, do you think.I'm sure you think about this, but do you think you did all those things in hopes that she would see that and you were success so that you could help her change her ways?

Carol Look00:12:36

No.

Matt Gilhooly00:12:37

No, no.

Carol Look00:12:38

Isn't that interesting? I thought about that and. No, because it. And it didn't work. None. None of that. None of that worked.But I was just naturally loved being with people, loved being in class and loved being on the sports team. All of that was not forced.It was all fun for me and then turned out to be the most adaptive, healthy thing have done instead of turning any other directions. So we're in this rehab and devastated and upset and guilty and hurt and mad and then sad. You know, every feeling in the book, right? No. Therapy.Never had therapy. Never had Alan on. And in one of the family groups.So we're with all the families in the morning and in the afternoon, counselors talking to us and, you know, asking me about my drug and alcohol history. You know, how much do you. In high school, were you doing this? What were you doing? And a woman comes out to give the family lecture.She had had the worst story I had ever heard. Drinking, drinking, drinking, baby. Being taken away from her, still drinking, like, just incredible. I was like. And she said. And was happy.And she said, you can be happy and have a good life even if your alcoholic keeps drinking. And I was like, what? Who are you? What are you talking about? My mother is my mother. No. Yes. No. And that was the turning point for me.That was a decision for me of this is what I'm going to do. I'm going to help people understand that they can be happy no matter what's going on. They can have a life.Even if someone, they, the closest person to them in their life, decides to go down a different path. And that led to therapy. Al Anon Talking about it, figuring it out, it's not my fault. I didn't do it. I didn't cause it.All those phrases, it was such an eye opener. It was like, I don't understand. She's happy. She ruined her life and she's happy and sober. And talking to the family members saying, guess what?It's your life. You better do something with your life. Because if you stay at home waiting for your alcoholic to get sober, it may never happen.And that shattered something too. Cause, oh, no, oh, no, we can still pour out the bottles. We can still take the keys away, whatever.All kids go through, all spouses go through, all adult children go through, you know, all everybody goes through. So that was a real turning point because I ended up storing that away and it took a while, but I ended up then leaving a corporate life.I was in corporate for very few years, but. And become. And getting my degree and becoming a psychotherapist.

Matt Gilhooly00:15:10

It kind of almost like, to our point of like, permission, it was almost like that that woman gave you permission to live your own life.

Carol Look00:15:19

Yes. Not be so sick with worry. I talk a lot.In the book that I wrote, I was talking about my story for the first time and how it wasn't like we had trauma after trauma. People Talk about trauma all the time. Yes, there were one or two car accidents that were horrible. Right. But it was more.My trauma was looking over my shoulder, waiting for the shoe to drop. My mother would be sober for months, weeks, years, boom. Years, weeks, months, boom. And you could just never, never fully relax and centered.High anxiety, high hypervigilance. And that was one of the gifts of this program. Going out for family week and just saying it's going to happen.It may happen, it may not happen, but it's not you. What do you mean, it's not me? What do you mean? We can't affect this, right? They have to decide. They have to hit bottom there.And my father was alcoholic too, but at that point, he was getting away with it the way he was much more high functioning, going to work every day. There was no problem. You know, he would drink after five and get away with it.So my life, I mean, I talk about how I can count 20 alcoholics without blinking an eye in three generations in my family, people say, well, why don't you. Would you like a drink? No, no, thanks. I don't think I'll go that direction right now. Seen that, done that.But it's unusual to have that many alcoholics in a family. And then what I say is, but it has nothing to do with it. We also overeat, we also all smoke. And it's because we're not dealing with our feelings.People oh, oh, oh. They'll say, carol, you have. That's so much alcoholism in your family. Get off the alcoholism and say, what is it really going on?There's so much anxiety. My family, I would say, tends towards anxiety, not depression. But this is generations, cousins, you know, all over the place.

Matt Gilhooly00:17:10

Alcohol is just the chosen substance.

Carol Look00:17:12

Chosen substance. It's just a thing. It's just a thing. But once you realize, because I was a smoker in high school, a heavy.

Matt Gilhooly00:17:19

Smoker, well, and that was cool.

Carol Look00:17:21

That what was cool. But it was delicious. It worked, right? It worked. That's when people come to me with weight issues. I was like, don't be mad at yourself. Food works.I had a weight issue going up and down and up and down. And it's funny that you were talking about grief because that's what I ended up having to heal. I didn't know it at the time.I didn't know it for years. Oh, I haven't grieved the back and forth.Loss and the back and forth with my mother, and the hope's up and we're so close and she Was this incredible person. And then she drink, and then she'd drink, and.And it was the grief and the abandonment and that feeling of being kicked in the head so many times that I had to. That. That was the deepest work I did, which then changed everything. I was making progress. But things really.

Matt Gilhooly00:18:08

And we just don't talk about it with. Especially with kids or even teens. It's like, get over it or whatever. But I think we naturally absorb some kind of. Or I did at least like a.Like a savior complex in a way. I guess I could relate it to that, of, like, making sure that my. My dad, my grandmother, the people around me knew I was happy.And so it was like my mission to be perfect.

Carol Look00:18:34

Yes.

Matt Gilhooly00:18:35

So that they would be happy also, so they wouldn't abandon me like my mom had, which is, like, really weird to say out loud.But just as you identify that period in your life as, like, grieving or, like, having to go through the grief of that, it's like, that's what I was doing. I was trying to be perfect so my dad wouldn't also leave.

Carol Look00:18:56

Right. So. So easy to do. So easy to fall into a pattern that we think, ooh, this might work. Ooh, this might work. Maybe this is it.Maybe if I'm, you know, behave this way, act this way or whatever. As I say, the only good news is that it wasn't when we were really little. Your brain's different when you're 5 and 8 than when you're 13, 14, and 16.You know, it's different, but it was still incredibly painful. And then imagine all those alcoholics, so cousins in laws, her sibling, you know, lots of other alcohols, just perpetuates it.

Matt Gilhooly00:19:27

Yeah.

Carol Look00:19:27

So we're not into. Can we talk about the alcoholic who needs help now?Because there are five others that need help that are hiding it, saying, no, no, I don't have a problem. So, you know, secret, but not a secret.But other people are doing it, too, and getting in trouble or not getting in as much trouble as she was getting in.

Matt Gilhooly00:19:49

Do you find it in your conversations with other people? I mean, I think it's natural as humans that we start to compare our situations.But do you find it unique to you that you had a really good relationship with, like, growing up with your parents and the fact that in parallel with that, they were fighting whatever demons they were fighting to kind of COVID that up? Is that unique?

Carol Look00:20:15

I think it is a little bit unique because a lot of people will tell you it was a disaster from the beginning. They remember Nothing good.And my parents had this ability to bond with people, and they were grateful and they were loving and they were funny, and they were like all these things, and then boom. So I think it is somewhat unusual.I wouldn't say totally unique, but somewhat unusual because a lot of other people will say they were terrible people and they drank and then they beat us and they. Nothing like that.

Matt Gilhooly00:20:45

Right.

Carol Look00:20:45

But.

Matt Gilhooly00:20:46

But they were just fighting their own.

Carol Look00:20:48

Out of control. Out of control drinking, which then leads to, you know, fighting and, you know, other things. But.So I think it's funny to say, you know, talk about it as a trauma for me, looking over my shoulder, because so many people suffered profound traumas as children. Profound, including yours. And it's hard to explain to people. This was traumatic for me.And some people say, well, maybe you can't relate to a bigger story or something more upsetting. And I say, here's what I can relate to. You've been guilty, I've been guilty. You've been shamed. I've been shamed. You've been hurt, I've been hurt.It's the feelings, not the event. And they've learned that about trauma work anyway. It's not the car accident. It's not the abuse.It's how did you feel about it, how did you take it, how did you interpret it, and what did you do with it? That's how you define trauma.

Matt Gilhooly00:21:38

Well, and it's so funny that you say that. It's not funny. The word is wrong. But it's. It's this journey. I learned that on this journey is I've.I've talked to people about these, like, terribly tragic things. And we were talking, and I naturally got into the comparative, like, oh, well, mine's not as bad as yours kind of talk.And they were like, you know what? Your worst moment, you can relate. Because my worst moment was also my worst moment. And those are both the worst things we've ever experienced.And so to. To what you just said, it's the worst feeling you've ever had. So it is comparable.Not that we're comparing, but at the same time, you can connect with someone else's worst moment if you've also had one.

Carol Look00:22:22

Yes. And kids need to feel safe.And whether it's a sibling who's acting out or a parent who's alcoholic or someone who dies or the school teacher is not favorable towards them, you know, is mean to them, or kids are bullying, it doesn't matter. All of those lead to not feeling safe. And our brains, human beings, Must feel safe in order to thrive and grow.

Matt Gilhooly00:22:46

Yeah. Although you know, as a teen you said you were thriving publicly. Right. You were thriving.

Carol Look00:22:53

And it was good for me to be with other people and doing, you know, singing and playing sports and being a good student, et cetera. But the background pain that was going on was devastating.

Matt Gilhooly00:23:05

Did you have a vice besides smoking? I guess was vice smoking.

Carol Look00:23:11

About age 15, for about 10 years smoking. And then I did get into drinking and drugs in high school. Stopped that eventually.It was just sort of the poor, that poor kid was so anxious, so anxious.

Matt Gilhooly00:23:25

Did you have the feeling that you needed to, to help fix or solve your parents issues? Because you said you went to, you did. So you had like a savior complex in some capacity as well.

Carol Look00:23:36

Always thought if I try one more thing, it's sort of the classic Al Anon story. If I try this, if I do it this way. But it wasn't by being a good student and being that was, I think surviving in a healthy way.But then I'd come home and say, who's been drinking? You know, who's been drinking? What's changed? What's going on? What can I do? How do we prevent this? Who do we not tell?There was a lot of emotion around. How do we keep this private? Well, it wasn't private. There's nothing wrong about it. Everybody knew, right? That's always, always going on.

Matt Gilhooly00:24:09

And how old were you at this like life shift moment in which you got permission to, to be the full carol that you always knew you wanted to be?

Carol Look00:24:17

Very early 20s, super early. There had been other moments before then, but I didn't get it. This was a appropriate mirror shock. This woman saying, hey guys, they may not change.And am I being so surprised by that? And you can still have a life. That was the, that was the permission.

Matt Gilhooly00:24:37

Yeah. No, I mean I think it's, it's beautiful. I think a lot of people have this, a similar type experience in their journey.Like maybe so and so said something for years and years and years and then this one time so and so some other person said it and you're like, oh, that makes total sense or that's going to change my life. Or they read a book for a second time and they find a segment that just really speaks to them at that moment.So I think there's probably like you needed all those trials and tribulations to get the permission to actually stick and.

Carol Look00:25:09

It didn't change the grief. So I was still heartbroken. I was still heartbroken very. Every time somebody relapsed how did it.

Matt Gilhooly00:25:18

Change you so, like, when you walked out that day, what. What felt different for you?

Carol Look00:25:22

I didn't have to be in a job that I hated in corporate. I didn't have to be so focused. It was a process. So focused on is she, isn't he right now? Drinking saved less, checked up.It was really, for me, the anxiety was checking up. So there wasn't really anything I could do to save, but it was like checking, are you sure? Are you sure? Are you sure?And that's what really killed my nervous system. That and the bouncing back and the back and forth and the, yeah, she's relapsed or he's real. My father never got sober in his life.She got sober a million times.

Matt Gilhooly00:25:58

So you have this, this mentality now. Okay, I don't have to check in so much. Like, part of me is like, do you just then just quit doing all that?Or was it a weaning off process for you, in which you were like, okay, I'll check in once a month versus every night.

Carol Look00:26:14

Weaning off. Right, Weaning off and. And getting my ability back online to focus more on me, even if things were not going well at home.

Matt Gilhooly00:26:24

Because up until this point, you hadn't talked to anyone about any of these issues besides maybe in the rehab situations, even close.

Carol Look00:26:32

Closest friend growing up, her father was alcoholic. And we never talked about it. It's like, this is what happens. And we don't. You don't talk about it. You walk on eggshells, you tiptoe around the other.The parents are talking about it or, you know, saying something about it.

Matt Gilhooly00:26:47

So, yeah, so those. So like, I guess the years after that, you're kind of watering.If we're going to go with this metaphor of planting a seed, we're kind of watering that. Are you taking little baby steps to get the therapy, get the, you know, and then changing careers. Like, how does all that play together?

Carol Look00:27:06

Well, the idea that I could help people feel as good as she, that counselor made me feel in the moment like it wasn't. Wasn't that I felt so good. It was that I felt hopeful. It was like, oh, there's another way.

Matt Gilhooly00:27:19

Yeah, there's a future.

Carol Look00:27:21

Oh, that's really. That's. I love this and I love people and I could do this and didn't like the corporate job I was in.Anyway, I was there for a very short time, but I worked in a bank loaning money to. Loaning money to big companies. So it was a process of. Then Going back to graduate school, getting my degree and working through all that.But, you know, that's. It's not. It's not a couple of weeks of therapy. Right. It's a lot of unpacking. It's a lot of unpacking. A lot of unpacking, yeah.

Matt Gilhooly00:27:48

I guess I'm kind of like wondering what's that period of time? I guess is a helpful question of, like, when you got the permission to.When you were able to, like, feel more Carol, and then also start helping people. Like, what does that time period look like for you?

Carol Look00:28:06

I would. That's a very good question. I would say about three to five years.So made the shift, went to grad school, started working with people, got a job, et cetera, et cetera, in the new field, and then really felt like, oh, this is my calling. Oh, I. Okay, I get it, I get it. I know all the pain. I mean, my wisdom now, looking back, I was not smart back then. I was not wise back then.But now I can see the path unfolding. I can see all the pieces that had to come together to make it work and keep working on myself. It doesn't end.

Matt Gilhooly00:28:42

No. What did that personal therapy journey look like for you? Because I think that's really something I wish I had access to earlier.Maybe I did, but nobody was helping me find it and I had to find it on my own. But once it started happening, it's like, shout it from the rooftops to everyone else. Like, when you're ready, do it.Because it's like so valuable to get everything out of your head and get some tools to move forward. So what? How did unpacking all of that and then repacking it in a nice way that feels right for you look like.

Carol Look00:29:17

So because we were at the family week at this rehab, famous rehab center that people went to. They said you need to go to Al Anon and group therapy at a center.So in a group, everybody had a slightly different story, but everybody had a very painful story about an alcoholic in their life. Some were kids, some were married to, some were parents of. So the variety was fascinating.And then just being able to say, they all understand how painful. They all understand the helplessness and the powerlessness. Then there was al anon, a 12 step program.But honestly, a lot changed when I found energy work. The talking didn't do as much now. Maybe it did, and I didn't know because I was too young and I didn't get it.But once I found energy work that works with the body and Your cells and your brain. It's different than talking.

Matt Gilhooly00:30:12

Yeah. Where on that, where in your journey was did you, did you encounter that for the first time?Because I feel like it's not like as mainstream as talk therapy would be.

Carol Look00:30:23

Or as no psychiatry, maybe another five, 10 years. So I was, you know, I was very loyal to therapy and did it and went to it and individual therapy and group therapy.And then when I found the tapping, really, oh, everything changed in me. Everything changed in my clients. Everything changed. It was like, oh, okay. And later.Now looking back, what I understand is that trauma gets lodged in your body, fear gets lodged in the nervous system. And talking and feeling better and having compassion and empathy and all of that is wonderful. It does not get to the root of it.It doesn't get to the bottom of it. So I will never negate the therapy. I had never say it didn't do anything for me at all. However.

Matt Gilhooly00:31:08

Sure, it validated a lot, right?

Carol Look00:31:10

Validated helped me not feel alone. It was the first time I could talk and not feel ashamed about it. It was wonderful. It was life changing.And then I found energy work and I was like, oh, okay. The brain's involved the nervous system. When I say I was anxious, I think I joke in my family, I was born anxious, right?So finding cigarettes, finding sugar, finding alcohol, all those things were like, woo hoo. And finding, tapping and eft and some of those techniques was like, feel it in my nervous system.My poor little nervous system was so on edge and waiting and looking over my shoulder and is there going to be like half the planet and is there going to be another accident and am I going to be happy because everybody's sober and then boom, be surprised because that's what does something to your nervous system. You know, you're all same, everything's fine. Like you were when you were called, when your father sat you down and said, I have bad news.Like, everybody has a. I have bad news.

Matt Gilhooly00:32:11

Yeah. I don't envy him, by the way. Separate.

Carol Look00:32:15

No.

Matt Gilhooly00:32:16

Having to say those things to a little kid. No, no, thanks. Were you seeking out the energy healing? Like, is that something that was always kind of like, I didn't, I didn't.

Carol Look00:32:26

Know anything about it. I didn't even know what it was.

Matt Gilhooly00:32:28

But you were open to it.

Carol Look00:32:29

Open to it. Well, I was, I was a traditional psychotherapist and then I got into hypnos. Thought hypnosis is so cool.Wonderful how the brain works, how we can, you know, respond in different ways. Loved it. And someone in my hypnosis class said, you think this is fun? You got to try this weird, weird stuff where you tap on acupuncture points.I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about. I took my first class and I was like, okay, I got it. I'm in, I'm in.And the first thing that happened for me without working on myself for insomnia, I was working on everybody else for different things. My insomnia, my long term anxious insomnia went away and it was like, I got it. I'm tuned. I am sold.My nervous system was finally being calmed down now because when I was a hypnotist, you get sent people for quit smoking, food cravings and anxiety. And they say, you're my last resort. I've tried everything. And what I started doing is saying, yeah, we'll do a little bit of hypnosis. And.And I learned this new stress relief technique. If I do it for five minutes and you don't like it, I'll give you the five minutes at the end of your session.And time after time after time, they're like, what just happened? What are you doing? And I don't, I don't go near them. I say, follow me. Do this. What are you doing? What's going on?Because they could all feel it, even skeptical. And I was super skeptical in the beginning. Even skeptical people go, they feel something, the vagus nerve.Everything starts to calm down and they feel different. And that's what happened to me. And then it was like, sold. And the rest, the rest is history. That's been my career.

Matt Gilhooly00:34:06

Yeah, I mean, it is. It's like I am someone that feels. I don't know what it is about. It's probably my trauma trapped in there.It's probably all sorts of things of trying to be a perfectionist my whole life, but it's like I still have blocks of traditional whatever and then things that seem outside of that. And I'm getting better because I talk to people like you. I talk to other energy healers, I talk to mediums, I talk to all sorts of people.And there's still something in me that, that feels like if I were to try this now, I haven't. I have a book right over there. It's not your book, but I have a book on tapping. And. And part of me is like, I'm going to do it wrong.I'm sure there are other people like me on the planet. How do you get people through that? Is it just by doing? And it just becomes yes, they feel.

Carol Look00:34:59

It by doing and saying, it's really simple and human beings want to make it complicated. Well, really simple. Yeah, but I didn't get Americans. Americans, right? And they say I didn't do.You know, I give them homework, and they say, I didn't do my homework because what if I did it wrong? I'm like, you can do it ineffectively, but you can't really do it wrong, and you can't hurt anybody or hurt yourself.So I teach them how to do it, and they say, yeah, but I can't do it the way you do. I'm going to write it out for you, and you're going to follow the bouncing ball and do it.And they would keep getting results, and then they'd say, I'll try it even if it's imperfect, I'll do it again. I'll try it even if it's not done perfectly. And I've had years of training and years of practice, so of course there's going to be fluid in my hands.It's going to be easier. So I will offer you a session after the podcast. Not today, but another time, where I'll just lead you through it, show it to you.The worst that can happen is you go, carol, it's not for me. I don't care. I don't care.

Matt Gilhooly00:35:52

Now is there, I wonder, I'm curious about this, and I know this is not directly related to your story, but are there people that try it and it doesn't work, or does it work on everyone? That's a weird question, but.

Carol Look00:36:05

Well, here's how I would put it. Some people don't like it, and it's not their tool, but it works on people because we're working.We're tuning in to the fight or flight response in the brain. So we're calming it down while you're pairing it with something that's upsetting you.So if you're afraid of flying, if you had a fight with your boss, if you were upset about a family reunion coming up, you tune into it, you open the file, and while the file is open, we're using the tapping technique, which calms down the fight or flight response. So you've paired the thing you're upset about with a healing, calming technique. Right. So it works on human beings, they do it on animals.It works on animals, it works on human beings if you have an electrical energy system. But some people are like, oh, that's interesting. Some people are resistant, some people don't like it. Some people say.Some people don't want to feel better, and they're surprised by how it makes them feel. And that's rocking the boat. So lots of things, but people, mostly people don't come to me if they're too skeptical, they don't want to try it.They don't come into my, you know, they don't show up.

Matt Gilhooly00:37:09

Speaking of that idea, just wondering if you experienced that for. For living so much of your life in high anxiety and living in this what's going to happen next kind of mode. Did you find it hard to let go of that?Because it's so familiar. And the reason I asked that is, like, for so long, I felt like, depression, like, deep depression and those things in my teenage years.And it was so much easier to stay depressed than it was to. Who knows what I'm going to be like if I'm not like that. Did you experience any of that?

Carol Look00:37:41

Yes. Because technically, it's dangerous to let my guard down. That was the message, right? Don't let your guard down because you will get smacked.And then, guess what happens after my mother gets sober is other things happen. Right. 9, 11 happens. I was in New York. My sister died of cancer three months later.No things happen that continue to reinforce the message, be careful. Don't let your guard down.But it is so much better that I can sleep, that I lost the 20, 25 pounds, that I have good relationships, that I love my work. Right. I don't overwork anymore, you know, so the behavior. When people say, well, how do you know if you're changing?Look at your results, look at your behavior. What's different, right?

Matt Gilhooly00:38:28

And look over a period of time versus like yesterday.

Carol Look00:38:31

Exactly, exactly. Yeah.

Matt Gilhooly00:38:32

Sometimes we want that immediate, but if we wait a couple months and we look back, we're like, oh, it's like weight loss. It's like, you know, muscles or whatever else you're trying to. To gain. I think that's. That's fascinating.It's funny to think or to talk out loud about whatever problems I had in the past, you know, whether that's depression, anxiety, perfectionism, disordered eating in some capacity. Thinking about all those and talking about it now like it's just another part of my life. And it was just. It just is.Like there's no shame in it because I was just being. Trying to survive essentially, at the time, you know, do you. Do you look back on that experience and wish for different, or is that something it was.It was what it was.

Carol Look00:39:22

I learned to accept all my mistakes and say it wasn't a mistake. You know, think of the. A bad boyfriend or think of smoking too much or being overweight or whatever it was, or having a.I didn't have fights with people, but, you know, something like that and thinking, well, I was doing the best I possibly could with my nervous system, my background, my training or lack of training, my experience or lack of experience. Like, I don't expect my little nephews to do something that they should do at age 15 when they're 8. Like, it doesn't make any sense.So at every decade and every few years, it's like, I was honestly doing the best I can. And that's how I treat my clients, too. It's like they come in and say, oh, my God, you're not gonna believe what happened. I was like, yes, yes, I do.And if you could have done it another way, you would have. I was just gonna say something about the difference, though. With depression, I think anxiety is more.They're both chemistry driven, but I think anxiety is more learned and depression is more chemical. Now you could have 10 therapists on saying, carol, that's wrong. That's not how I see. That's how I feel about it. So that my anxiety was a training.Now, yes, everybody's technical conditioning, conditioning and training. Whereas depression, you had the biggest loss you could have had at age 8. That's going to trigger a depressive episode that may be for years.

Matt Gilhooly00:40:46

Well, and to your point about, like, doing the best that we can, and then we kind of learn from those experiences and we do different the next time. After my mom died, my dad's mother became kind of like my mother figure. She became like a best friend, if you will.And when she was diagnosed with cancer and we kind of knew, like, this was how it was going to go, I felt that what I didn't get from losing my mom, I was going to do right this time. And so I found it a beautiful ending. I was able to have the final conversation where I sat her down.I said, no, we're doing this because you're not getting better. And I'm going to tell you everything that you need to know about our relationship and what you've done for me.I'd love for you to do the same if you can. And we did.We had this beautiful, like, conversation that I hope other people have, but I don't think they do because it's so scary, because it's really like, an official goodbye. But I didn't want to not have that because I didn't get that with my Mom.And then I spent the last 96 hours of her life by her bedside and she waited for me. I fell asleep the last day and my dad's, like, time to wake up and she passed away like a couple seconds after I sat next to her bed. So she.We had the bond, we had the things. We did all the things right. But I don't think I would have had that beautiful goodbye had I not had that earlier experience.And so I say all that to say I didn't know how to do it right the first time, but I sure as hell knew how to do it right for me the second time. I had to face something so hard that's so beautiful.

Carol Look00:42:25

But let me disagree. It's not because you didn't. Weren't able to do it right the first time.You did something in between in the intervening years that allowed you to have compassion, composure and maturity, no matter what your chronological age was to talk to her. There are people who have it the way you did as under age 10. And they never learn, they never get the tools.They have regrets, but they still don't know what to say when the second caregiver is on their way out. So you did some. Please give yourself credit. You did something in between in those years that allowed you to give. Oh, my God.Give her that and give yourself that. Is there anything better? There's nothing better.

Matt Gilhooly00:43:09

No. And I really. Even the last couple days in the hospice house, that.And I didn't leave her side because I knew she was at the hospital when I took my first breath. I wanted to be there when she took her last one. For all the things that she had done and sacrificed for me after my mom had died. But I do, I.I mean, I still look at the things I didn't get to do with my mother, the fact that I don't remember my mother. And there's like, having to release the guilt of that. You know, I was eight. Like, I can't.You don't remember much and not much, you know, and you're not deep seating those because you don't know it's going to end. So, you know, I think it's just a beautiful thing to be able to.To learn from the things that maybe we see as mistakes, whether they're mislabeled or not. I look back at some of the things I did after my mom died, and I see them as mistakes, but I don't own them.

Carol Look00:44:04

You were surviving. You're doing the best you could with what you had. And then to turn it around and be that way for your, for your grandmother and for you.As I say, when I say, what else is there besides connection and conversation? That's why this podcast is so important for people. Conversation. We are human beings.They did all this work on trauma, you know, the famous guy Bessel van der Gock. Trauma does not heal alone. You must heal your trauma in community.If Your community is three people or it's your family of four people, or it's your new friendships of five people or 20, or a big community, but you cannot heal trauma alone. And you were doing trauma healing with her. She lost her either daughter or daughter in law, whatever it was.

Matt Gilhooly00:44:50

Right.

Carol Look00:44:50

Daughter in law. And raised you was a big influence in raising you. So, so special.

Matt Gilhooly00:44:56

Yeah, well.

Carol Look00:44:58

So special.

Matt Gilhooly00:44:58

Well, thank you. I'm very proud of that moment and I'm very happy I did it and I try to influence others to do it, but I understand that's a very hard thing to do.Speaking of hard things to do, since you were in the profession, you were serving others, you were serving yourself. By serving others, you were creating community out of this.Did you ever have the opportunity to talk more with your parents about what was haunting them? And was that healing?

Carol Look00:45:26

With my mother, yes.My father wasn't open to it then when my sister died, they fell apart in different ways and he was a little more open, but it was just too painful for them. It was too painful. But my mother, when my mother got sober, so then she eventually had long term sobriety. Long term.And we were able to talk about everything, talk with each other. We were again so close and could finish each other's sentences and just very, very close and heal. We healed, we forgave, we healed, we understood.And it was just incredible.

Matt Gilhooly00:46:03

Yeah. Did she seem like a different person at that point?Because I know you had a great relationship, but there is something to be said when you're holding on to something so hard.

Carol Look00:46:12

She was different because she had been smashed to smithereens by her own drinking and her own regrets and her own shame. So you grow from that. And then she was long term in therapy and long term and AA with wonderful friends wherever she lived.And it the healing community where she's helping others, they're helping her, people are relapsing back and forth. And I think she just now, I think she changed a lot.I think before there was a lot of protection and then there was much more vulnerability and accessibility.

Matt Gilhooly00:46:47

Did she know that your journey was because of that?

Carol Look00:46:52

Yes.

Matt Gilhooly00:46:52

Yes, that. And, and did she feel a good Good about that. That because you're helping so many people or was there like a.

Carol Look00:46:59

No, she felt really good about it and proud of it and.And thought again, the way my family was in spite of all this drinking, that that's what makes us come alive is human beings and people conversations and connections and laughter and, you know, loving each other in spite of things that are going wrong or things that are upsetting. So she was really happy about it.

Matt Gilhooly00:47:21

Yeah, I think that's. That's a beautiful, like, coming back around kind of moment. Also curious if when you. Maybe when you were starting out or at all, did you ever.Did you gravitate towards or connect more with people that had similar experiences to you? I find I do, but I don't know if that's a common thing.

Carol Look00:47:40

The common thing is the feelings of helplessness or hurt or grief. So somebody else could have had a death in the family and I didn't. Felt like I did, but I didn't. And it's the same feelings.So it's not like my friends were all people who had alcoholic parents. But you find out, of course, how many people have some kind of dysfunction.Drugs, alcohol, again, a sibling who's acting out, somebody who's in jail, somebody.There are a lot of problems going on in people's families that you don't hear about until someone opens up and says, you know, it's really been hard for me. And then they start to talk.

Matt Gilhooly00:48:18

How do we fix it?

Carol Look00:48:20

Which part?

Matt Gilhooly00:48:21

How do we help people feel more comfortable even before they reach out to someone in your profession, but just feel more comfortable being their full selves or sharing that and avoiding the shame as much as possible? Is there a solve.

Carol Look00:48:36

Acceptance. So they don't accept themselves. I didn't accept myself. Took me a long time. And that's the movement towards healing. This is who I am.This is how I feel. Because we get the message. If you feel angry, you shouldn't. If you feel ashamed, that's bad. If you feel jealous, you shouldn't.Accepting that a feeling is a feeling. They're not good feelings and bad feelings. They're uncomfortable feelings. Right.But accepting the discomfort, accepting the pain and saying it may feel like it's going to kill you, but it's not. Be with it, Be in it. Breathe. Do your tools. Use whatever you can. Right. And then you start to move through, because that's the validation process.And everybody's always looking for validation from someone else. Yep.

Matt Gilhooly00:49:24

Well, starts with grades in school.

Carol Look00:49:27

We gotta. We gotta see. Exactly.But we have to start with validating ourselves, including, I feel terrible because I didn't get a good grade or I didn't get chosen for the soccer team, or I didn't get chosen for something starting with just, I feel bad, I feel terrible. And what do people do? Oh, don't be silly. It's okay. Oh, no, you're gonna be fine. You're gonna be fine. My least favorite in the world. It's okay.No, it's not okay. It's not okay.

Matt Gilhooly00:49:52

It really sucks.

Carol Look00:49:53

Yeah, it really sucks.

Matt Gilhooly00:49:55

No, it's so. So many of the things you've said in this conversation, and I know we need to focus on your story, but so many of the things have been so validating.I keep going to that word because one of the biggest things that helped me in kind of my healing journey was when I realized it was okay to feel however I was feeling at any moment in time and acknowledge it. Like, I'm having a bad day today. Okay, you know how to get out of this. Eventually you will. You don't stay in there. Just acknowledge it.And eventually you'll use the tools that you have to move through it. And it's just like, that was a big part of it. And so now people. I don't know if you experience this because you have alcoholics in your family.You probably have people like, you had an alcoholic in your family. What do you do when this, that, or the other. But you're in that profession. I have people like, oh, you have a dead mom. What do you do?

Carol Look00:50:49

Yes.

Matt Gilhooly00:50:49

Like, how do I. I'm sad. How do I deal? I'm like, you need to allow yourself to feel however you're feeling at any moment in time.So if someone died yesterday and you happen to laugh today, you did. You're a human. I think having the permission to just be is so helpful. But I hate that question. Do you get that question?Well, you do in your profession, but.

Carol Look00:51:11

Personally, I get, you know, when is this going to end? When is the pain going to end? Right.And if you live life and you love people, news flash, the pain is going to come back and forth, and it's how we handle it. If you love people, you're going to lose people. Right? We're going to be disappointed, we're going to be sad, we're going to be.Have conflicts, we're going to be upset if a family member says something, you know, a lot can go on, and it's really about, as you say, presence. So permission was a word we said early on, and then Presence. Be present with yourself. Find someone who can be present with you.That's why people like journaling so much. Who's. Nobody's arguing with them, they're just writing what's going on, pages and pages. Find someone who says, you can be wherever you are.And I'm not changing it. I'm not changing you. And I'm not going to disagree.

Matt Gilhooly00:52:01

Just listen.

Carol Look00:52:02

Just listen.

Matt Gilhooly00:52:03

I'll tell you. I had. You know, I thought losing my mom was tough. I thought losing my grandmother was really hard.I recently lost my 14 and a half year old puppy and it has been, sorry, the most surprising of grief journeys that I've ever been on because I'm like, I'm a pro, like I know how to lose people I really love.But this pet loss has been something that I've been so fascinated and I found myself apologizing to people in my past for somewhat not dismissing but not being as empathetic because I didn't have that experience. But like I'm going back in my, my Rolodex of people I knew that lost animals me. Like, I'm sorry.

Carol Look00:52:48

Yes.

Matt Gilhooly00:52:49

Such a fascinating thing. Grief is very weird.

Carol Look00:52:51

Grief is weird. Losing a pet is weird. Losing the unconditional love is terrible. The touch, the shadow, terrible. So painful.And every time we have a grief, it triggers all the old ones. Anything that's remaining that we haven't dealt with, pop comes up.

Matt Gilhooly00:53:09

What do you think people yell at me when I say this. What do you think about when people say they've closed the door on grief on a particular person?So in my thoughts, I say that a lot about losing my mom because I don't remember her very much. So I feel like I've done all the grieving there. What do you think when people say that?

Carol Look00:53:29

I think grief doesn't end. It's a process for years and years, for the rest of your life because it changes things, it shapes you differently. So my sister died years ago.We've never been the same. I will never be the same. She's missing every Christmas, every time her daughter reaches a milestone, every time her son reaches a milestone.I'm different because she was younger than we were. Four girls and she was the youngest. Never be the same. Do I cry all the time about it? No. But it's not over. And I don't think the door closes.I think you grow with it. You become different. It's part of you. Like your puppy is a part of you and will be for the next five decades, no matter what happens.No matter how many new dogs you get, no matter where you move in the world, no more. I can't do it no more. I know someone said that to me. They said, oh, I'd get a dog. But I couldn't tolerate the pain.I went, I know exactly what you mean. Yep.

Matt Gilhooly00:54:27

So you. You're spending, I'm assuming, years, decades now, helping others in this work that you're doing?

Carol Look00:54:34

Yes.

Matt Gilhooly00:54:35

How long have you been doing it?

Carol Look00:54:36

30 years.

Matt Gilhooly00:54:36

30 years. So decades doing this, helping people, and then you decide, why did. Why a book?

Carol Look00:54:43

I had written books before because the freedom. So the book is about all the sabotage behaviors that we do and figuring out why do we do sabotage behavior? Stop beating up on yourself.Why do we sabotage? And I was just introduced to a group of people that is a book writing group. And I had a lot in me, a lot of stories.And I'm always my first guinea pig. So I was a procrastinator. I was a people pleaser. I was a perfectionist. I was a clutter person. I had addiction issue, you know, weight up and down.So it was actually quite. It was a hard process, but it was really fun. And I just want people to say, oh, okay, don't beat up on yourself when you procrastinate.Figure out why you're doing it and then, voila. Then. Then you can start to heal it. This is, this is the other thing we were talking about where, you know, how. Validation.How do you get the validation? You understand that you're not being a bad person if you're a perfectionist, you learned it. Right.I always say, if you grew up in France, you're going to speak French. Right. Where did you grow up? What did you learn? Right. In my family, that was the part we were trying there, was trying to be perfect.That didn't go anywhere. All sorts of things. So it was really fun and just I wanted to reach more people. I mean, I have a big practice. I travel all over the world.I'm going to Australia to teach a workshop, and I've been, you know, all over. A book is going to reach more people.

Matt Gilhooly00:56:06

Yeah.And it's going to be one of those things where they're going to read it at the right time or they're going to read a certain part of it at the right time, and it's going to. That whole ripple, that whole butterfly effect that we talked about earlier is like, it's all you need. So, like, plant one seed.Like you had a seed planted in that rehab center that you were there For. For your mom. But it. It helped. It rehabbed you in a way.

Carol Look00:56:30

It did rehab me. And the book is about healing all those sabotage behaviors, what to do, how to clean it, how to clear it, all that.But a lot of people are writing me and saying, your personal story really helped. I'm like, no, no, no, get to the other chapter and, you know, stop the procrastination. And they will.But a lot of people are saying, it really helped me to hear that. You've been to hell and back, your own version. Right. You didn't have my trauma, but you had your trauma. So it's that I feel good about it.

Matt Gilhooly00:57:00

I feel power of story. I mean, just it's. It's the. The example of seeing someone in the space that you want to be someday.

Carol Look00:57:11

Yes.

Matt Gilhooly00:57:12

Whether that's president, whether that's, you know, like the first woman president, you know, now little girls, eventually little girls will be able to see that that's possible. So someone hearing your personal story, you overcame, if you will, you became a new person because of your experiences. Now it's possible.That's opportunity.

Carol Look00:57:32

And I still have feelings and still have conflicts, and there's still limitations in the world.

Matt Gilhooly00:57:37

You're not perfect.

Carol Look00:57:38

We're still in relationship with human beings. So, yes, I'm modeling. Not imperfection, but modeling. You can get through stuff. You can get through it. Well, you can get through it.You can cry your eyes out and journal and go to therapy and do tapping and join groups and do lots of things and come out on the other side.

Matt Gilhooly00:57:56

Well, I love that. That people actually specifically reached out to you and said the story part.

Carol Look00:58:03

Yeah.

Matt Gilhooly00:58:04

You know, because it. And your reaction of like, well, that's not really what the book's about. But, you know, but I think they'll get there.Because the first thing is to your earliest point here is the community.

Carol Look00:58:15

Yes.

Matt Gilhooly00:58:15

To feel that you belong to something, that there are other people out there like you that like similar things or feel similar ways is the first step. And then they'll come back to that. They'll come back to the steps to make them, you know, where they want to go. What is the name of the book?

Carol Look00:58:31

The yes Code. Transforming Sabotage into Success.

Matt Gilhooly00:58:36

And when did you release that?

Carol Look00:58:39

October. It was a lot of fun. It was hard. It was hard work, and it was a lot of fun to do.

Matt Gilhooly00:58:44

Did you learn anything special about yourself for this particular book that you put together?

Carol Look00:58:48

That I wanted to procrastinate doing it because I was telling my story and I didn't want My family to say, oh, Carol's coming out with all the family secrets now. It's like, yes, she is. And it's about time. And it's not a secret. And you know what? I didn't name anybody but my own family, and this is my story.

Matt Gilhooly00:59:04

Yeah. Did you get any of those reactions?

Carol Look00:59:06

No. Some silence. Let's just say my family is not reading it.

Matt Gilhooly00:59:10

I understand.

Carol Look00:59:11

Other people are reading it.

Matt Gilhooly00:59:12

Yeah. I always. I always love to kind of find a way to bring us home in these conversations. And I'm wondering if.If you now 20, 25, Carol, traveling the world in community with people around you, if you could go back to that Carol, walking into that last meeting at that rehab center before you got that seed, is there anything you'd want to tell her?

Carol Look00:59:35

There is support. Don't ever give up. There is support available. And keep with it. Keep with it. Keep with it, and stick to your values.So my values of community and connection and caring about people and making a difference, like, that's. That's what we have. We have our values. We have our integrity. We have.We try the best we can, even when we make terrible mistakes and just really, you know, honor. Honor yourself. I was going through a terrible time. Of course I was smoking cigarettes.Of course I was eating sugar like it was, you know, there was no tomorrow. What else worked?

Matt Gilhooly01:00:15

Yeah, you need a. You needed a little reprieve from. From that experience. Did you ever have the opportunity to bump into that. That woman again?

Carol Look01:00:24

No, I was out. We grew up in New Jersey. She was out in Minnesota at the. At the Hazleton Rehab Center. No.And I, you know, because I was so young back then, but I wish I had gotten it enough to even write a letter, to do something, to say, you made a difference. You made a difference.

Matt Gilhooly01:00:41

But how much older was she? Could she be listening?

Carol Look01:00:45

She could. Possible. It's possible.

Matt Gilhooly01:00:48

Thank you for planting that seed, whoever you are out there.

Carol Look01:00:51

Yes, thank you.

Matt Gilhooly01:00:53

If people want to learn more about you, connect with you, get in your circle, is there. What's the best way to kind of find you and your books and all the things that you do?

Carol Look01:01:02

Just the website. Carolook.com.

Matt Gilhooly01:01:05

Easy.

Carol Look01:01:05

Yes.

Matt Gilhooly01:01:06

And everything's there. Are you on social media? Are you.

Carol Look01:01:08

No, I was on it for a while. Got off. Considering getting back on, but it's mostly just through my website. And I do Siri programs and coaching programs and different.Have different opportunities, and the book is totally available.

Matt Gilhooly01:01:22

If someone's listening to your story and they want to tell you how much Your story affected them. They can find how to connect with you on the website. Yes, perfect.Instead of sending you a direct message on social media, they'll go email, we're going email.

Carol Look01:01:35

Email school, we're going old fashioned email or snail mail.

Matt Gilhooly01:01:39

Whatever we need here. That'll be great. No, thank you for sharing your story and your and having the conversation in this way.I hope you were able to share the parts of you that you feel were most important. But thank you for just being a part of this journey.

Carol Look01:01:52

It's been a pleasure. This is a connection that I like. I feel good about you and me and us together and what we can your whole show but what we're offering to people.And thank you for the ease. Thank you for just the ease with which this conversation unfolded. So I appreciate it.

Matt Gilhooly01:02:09

Well, thank you. Thank you for the permission. Also thank you for the validation throughout what you were saying to my own experiences.As I said when we started out, each conversation is really like and it sounds so cheesy to say, but it really is like a small healing piece of the version of me that I didn't know still needed the healing. Like it's all these little things and it's just really, I guess it's like this mosaic or a tapestry if we will.So thank you for being part of my healing journey in this way.

Carol Look01:02:42

My honor, My pleasure.

Matt Gilhooly01:02:44

If you are listening and there's someone out there that you think needs to hear Carol's story, please, we would love it if you share this episode with them.If you directly resonate with something that Carol said or want to know more about what she's offering to the world, please connect with her, go through our website carol look.com I'll put all that information in the show notes so it's super easy to get to. And thank you just for listening.It's just been an honor to be able to have this show and people listen to it and hopefully you're feeling less alone out there. I know the 8 year old version of Matt would love to hear a grown up version of Matt tell these stories and talk about his journey in this way.So thank you for being a part of this and thanks again to you, Carol.

Carol Look01:03:23

Thank you, Matt.

Matt Gilhooly01:03:36

For more information please visit www.thelifeshiftpodcast.com.